wassaying，willbeforbiddentointer—marry。This，however，isnottobeunderstoodasanabsoluteprohibitionofthemarriageofbrothersandsisters；ifthelotfavoursthem，andtheyreceivethesanctionofthePythianoracle，thelawwillallowthem。
Quiteright，hereplied。
Suchisthescheme，Glaucon，accordingtowhichtheguardiansofourStatearetohavetheirwivesandfamiliesincommon。Andnowyouwouldhavetheargumentshowthatthiscommunityisconsistentwiththerestofourpolity，andalsothatnothingcanbebetter——wouldyounot？
Yes，certainly。
ShallwetrytofindacommonbasisbyaskingofourselveswhatoughttobethechiefaimofthelegislatorinmakinglawsandintheorganizationofaState，——whatisthegreatestIgood，andwhatisthegreatestevil，andthenconsiderwhetherourpreviousdescriptionhasthestampofthegoodoroftheevil？
Byallmeans。
Cantherebeanygreaterevilthandiscordanddistractionandpluralitywhereunityoughttoreign？oranygreatergoodthanthebondofunity？
Therecannot。
Andthereisunitywherethereiscommunityofpleasuresandpains——whereallthecitizensaregladorgrievedonthesameoccasionsofjoyandsorrow？
Nodoubt。
Yes；andwherethereisnocommonbutonlyprivatefeelingaStateisdisorganized——whenyouhaveonehalfoftheworldtriumphingandtheotherplungedingriefatthesameeventshappeningtothecityorthecitizens？
Certainly。
Suchdifferencescommonlyoriginateinadisagreementabouttheuseoftheterms’mine’and’notmine，’’his’and’nothis。’
Exactlyso。
Andisnotthatthebest—orderedStateinwhichthegreatestnumberofpersonsapplytheterms’mine’and’notmine’inthesamewaytothesamething？
Quitetrue。
Orthatagainwhichmostnearlyapproachestotheconditionoftheindividual——asinthebody，whenbutafingerofoneofusishurt，thewholeframe，drawntowardsthesoulasacenterandformingonekingdomundertherulingpowertherein，feelsthehurtandsympathizesalltogetherwiththepartaffected，andwesaythatthemanhasapaininhisfinger；andthesameexpressionisusedaboutanyotherpartofthebody，whichhasasensationofpainatsufferingorofpleasureatthealleviationofsuffering。
Verytrue，hereplied；andIagreewithyouthatinthebest—orderedStatethereisthenearestapproachtothiscommonfeelingwhichyoudescribe。
Thenwhenanyoneofthecitizensexperiencesanygoodorevil，thewholeStatewillmakehiscasetheirown，andwilleitherrejoiceorsorrowwithhim？
Yes，hesaid，thatiswhatwillhappeninawell—orderedState。
Itwillnowbetime，Isaid，forustoreturntoourStateandseewhetherthisorsomeotherformismostinaccordancewiththesefundamentalprinciples。
Verygood。
OurStatelikeeveryotherhasrulersandsubjects？
True。
Allofwhomwillcalloneanothercitizens？
Ofcourse。
ButistherenotanothernamewhichpeoplegivetotheirrulersinotherStates？
Generallytheycallthemmasters，butindemocraticStatestheysimplycallthemrulers。
AndinourStatewhatothernamebesidesthatofcitizensdothepeoplegivetherulers？
Theyarecalledsavioursandhelpers，hereplied。
Andwhatdotherulerscallthepeople？
Theirmaintainersandfoster—fathers。
AndwhatdotheycalltheminotherStates？
Slaves。
AndwhatdotherulerscalloneanotherinotherStates？
Fellow—rulers。
Andwhatinours？
Fellow—guardians。
DidyoueverknowanexampleinanyotherStateofarulerwhowouldspeakofoneofhiscolleaguesashisfriendandofanotherasnotbeinghisfriend？
Yes，veryoften。
Andthefriendheregardsanddescribesasoneinwhomhehasaninterest，andtheotherasastrangerinwhomhehasnointerest？
Exactly。
Butwouldanyofyourguardiansthinkorspeakofanyotherguardianasastranger？
Certainlyhewouldnot；foreveryonewhomtheymeetwillberegardedbythemeitherasabrotherorsister，orfatherormother，orsonordaughter，orasthechildorparentofthosewhoarethusconnectedwithhim。
Capital，Isaid；butletmeaskyouoncemore：Shalltheybeafamilyinnameonly；orshalltheyinalltheiractionsbetruetothename？Forexample，intheuseoftheword’father，’wouldthecareofafatherbeimpliedandthefilialreverenceanddutyandobediencetohimwhichthelawcommands；andistheviolatorofthesedutiestoberegardedasanimpiousandunrighteouspersonwhoisnotlikelytoreceivemuchgoodeitheratthehandsofGodorofman？
Arethesetobeornottobethestrainswhichthechildrenwillhearrepeatedintheirearsbyallthecitizensaboutthosewhoareintimatedtothemtobetheirparentsandtherestoftheirkinsfolk？
These，hesaid，andnoneother；forwhatcanbemoreridiculousthanforthemtoutterthenamesoffamilytieswiththelipsonlyandnottoactinthespiritofthem？
Theninourcitythelanguageofharmonyandconcordwillbemoreoftenbeardthaninanyother。AsIwasdescribingbefore，whenanyoneiswellorill，theuniversalwordwillbewithmeitiswell’
or’itisill。’
Mosttrue。
Andagreeablytothismodeofthinkingandspeaking，werewenotsayingthattheywillhavetheirpleasuresandpainsincommon？
Yes，andsotheywill。
Andtheywillhaveacommoninterestinthesamethingwhichtheywillalikecall’myown，’andhavingthiscommoninteresttheywillhaveacommonfeelingofpleasureandpain？
Yes，farmoresothaninotherStates。
Andthereasonofthis，overandabovethegeneralconstitutionoftheState，willbethattheguardianswillhaveacommunityofwomenandchildren？
Thatwillbethechiefreason。
Andthisunityoffeelingweadmittedtobethegreatestgood，aswasimpliedinourowncomparisonofawell—orderedStatetotherelationofthebodyandthemembers，whenaffectedbypleasureorpain？
Thatweacknowledged，andveryrightly。
ThenthecommunityofwivesandchildrenamongourcitizensisclearlythesourceofthegreatestgoodtotheState？
Certainly。
Andthisagreeswiththeotherprinciplewhichwewereaffirming，——thattheguardianswerenottohavehousesorlandsoranyotherproperty；theirpaywastobetheirfood，whichtheyweretoreceivefromtheothercitizens，andtheyweretohavenoprivateexpenses；
forweintendedthemtopreservetheirtruecharacterofguardians。
Right，hereplied。
Boththecommunityofpropertyandthecommunityoffamilies，asI
amsaying，tendtomakethemmoretrulyguardians；theywillnottearthecityinpiecesbydifferingabout’mine’and’notmine；’eachmandragginganyacquisitionwhichhehasmadeintoaseparatehouseofhisown，wherehehasaseparatewifeandchildrenandprivatepleasuresandpains；butallwillbeaffectedasfarasmaybebythesamepleasuresandpainsbecausetheyareallofoneopinionaboutwhatisnearanddeartothem，andthereforetheyalltendtowardsacommonend。
Certainly，hereplied。
Andastheyhavenothingbuttheirpersonswhichtheycancalltheirown，suitsandcomplaintswillhavenoexistenceamongthem；theywillbedeliveredfromallthosequarrelsofwhichmoneyorchildrenorrelationsaretheoccasion。
Ofcoursetheywill。
Neitherwilltrialsforassaultorinsulteverbelikelytooccuramongthem。Forthatequalsshoulddefendthemselvesagainstequalsweshallmaintaintobehonourableandright；weshallmaketheprotectionofthepersonamatterofnecessity。
Thatisgood，hesaid。
Yes；andthereisafurthergoodinthelaw；viz。thatifamanhasaquarrelwithanotherhewillsatisfyhisresentmentthenandthere，andnotproceedtomoredangerouslengths。
Certainly。
Totheeldershallbeassignedthedutyofrulingandchastisingtheyounger。
Clearly。
Norcantherebeadoubtthattheyoungerwillnotstrikeordoanyotherviolencetoanelder，unlessthemagistratescommandhim；
norwillheslighthiminanyway。Fortherearetwoguardians，shameandfear，mightytopreventhim：shame，whichmakesmenrefrainfromlayinghandsonthosewhoaretothemintherelationofparents；fear，thattheinjuredonewillbesuccouredbytheotherswhoarehisbrothers，sons，onewifathers。
Thatistrue，hereplied。
Thenineverywaythelawswillhelpthecitizenstokeepthepeacewithoneanother？
Yes，therewillbenowantofpeace。
Andastheguardianswillneverquarrelamongthemselvestherewillbenodangeroftherestofthecitybeingdividedeitheragainstthemoragainstoneanother。
Nonewhatever。
Ihardlylikeeventomentionthelittlemeannessesofwhichtheywillberid，fortheyarebeneathnotice：such，forexample，astheflatteryoftherichbythepoor，andallthepainsandpangswhichmenexperienceinbringingupafamily，andinfindingmoneytobuynecessariesfortheirhousehold，borrowingandthenrepudiating，gettinghowtheycan，andgivingthemoneyintothehandsofwomenandslavestokeep——themanyevilsofsomanykindswhichpeoplesufferinthiswayaremeanenoughandobviousenough，andnotworthspeakingof。
Yes，hesaid，amanhasnoneedofeyesinordertoperceivethat。
Andfromalltheseevilstheywillbedelivered，andtheirlifewillbeblessedasthelifeofOlympicvictorsandyetmoreblessed。
Howso？
TheOlympicvictor，Isaid，isdeemedhappyinreceivingapartonlyoftheblessednesswhichissecuredtoourcitizens，whohavewonamoregloriousvictoryandhaveamorecompletemaintenanceatthepubliccost。ForthevictorywhichtheyhavewonisthesalvationofthewholeState；andthecrownwithwhichtheyandtheirchildrenarecrownedisthefulnessofallthatlifeneeds；theyreceiverewardsfromthehandsoftheircountrywhileliving，andafterdeathhaveanhonourableburial。
Yes，hesaid，andgloriousrewardstheyare。
Doyouremember，Isaid，howinthecourseofthepreviousdiscussionsomeonewhoshallbenamelessaccusedusofmakingourguardiansunhappy——theyhadnothingandmighthavepossessedallthings—towhomwerepliedthat，ifanoccasionoffered，wemightperhapshereafterconsiderthisquestion，butthat，asatpresentadvised，wewouldmakeourguardianstrulyguardians，andthatwewerefashioningtheStatewithaviewtothegreatesthappiness，notofanyparticularclass，butofthewhole？
Yes，Iremember。
Andwhatdoyousay，nowthatthelifeofourprotectorsismadeouttobefarbetterandnoblerthanthatofOlympicvictors——isthelifeofshoemakers，oranyotherartisans，orofhusbandmen，tobecomparedwithit？
Certainlynot。
AtthesametimeIoughtheretorepeatwhatIhavesaidelsewhere，thatifanyofourguardiansshalltrytobehappyinsuchamannerthathewillceasetobeaguardian，andisnotcontentwiththissafeandharmoniouslife，which，inourjudgment，isofalllivesthebest，butinfatuatedbysomeyouthfulconceitofhappinesswhichgetsupintohisheadshallseektoappropriatethewholeStatetohimself，thenhewillhavetolearnhowwiselyHesiodspoke，whenhesaid，’halfismorethanthewhole。’
Ifheweretoconsultme，Ishouldsaytohim：Staywhereyouare，whenyouhavetheofferofsuchalife。
Youagreethen，Isaid，thatmenandwomenaretohaveacommonwayoflifesuchaswehavedescribed——commoneducation，commonchildren；andtheyaretowatchoverthecitizensincommonwhetherabidinginthecityorgoingouttowar；theyaretokeepwatchtogether，andtohunttogetherlikedogs；andalwaysandinallthings，asfarastheyareable，womenaretosharewiththemen？
Andinsodoingtheywilldowhatisbest，andwillnotviolate，butpreservethenaturalrelationofthesexes。
Iagreewithyou，hereplied。
Theenquiry，Isaid，hasyettobemade，whethersuchacommunitybefoundpossible——asamongotheranimals，soalsoamongmen——andifpossible，inwhatwaypossible？
YouhaveanticipatedthequestionwhichIwasabouttosuggest。
Thereisnodifficulty，Isaid，inseeinghowwarwillbecarriedonbythem。
How？
Why，ofcoursetheywillgoonexpeditionstogether；andwilltakewiththemanyoftheirchildrenwhoarestrongenough，that，afterthemanneroftheartisan’schild，theymaylookonattheworkwhichtheywillhavetodowhentheyaregrownup；andbesideslookingontheywillhavetohelpandbeofuseinwar，andtowaitupontheirfathersandmothers。Didyouneverobserveintheartshowthepotters’boyslookonandhelp，longbeforetheytouchthewheel？
Yes，Ihave。
Andshallpottersbemorecarefulineducatingtheirchildrenandingivingthemtheopportunityofseeingandpractisingtheirdutiesthanourguardianswillbe？
Theideaisridiculous，hesaid。
Thereisalsotheeffectontheparents，withwhom，aswithotheranimals，thepresenceoftheiryoungoneswillbethegreatestincentivetovalour。
Thatisquitetrue，Socrates；andyetiftheyaredefeated，whichmayoftenhappeninwar，howgreatthedangeris！thechildrenwillbelostaswellastheirparents，andtheStatewillneverrecover。
True，Isaid；butwouldyouneverallowthemtorunanyrisk？
Iamfarfromsayingthat。
Well，butiftheyareevertorunariskshouldtheynotdosoonsomeoccasionwhen，iftheyescapedisaster，theywillbethebetterforit？
Clearly。
Whetherthefuturesoldiersdoordonotseewarinthedaysoftheiryouthisaveryimportantmatter，forthesakeofwhichsomeriskmayfairlybeincurred。
Yes，veryimportant。
Thisthenmustbeourfirststep，——tomakeourchildrenspectatorsofwar；butwemustalsocontrivethattheyshallbesecuredagainstdanger；thenallwillbewell。
True。
Theirparentsmaybesupposednottobeblindtotherisksofwar，buttoknow，asfarashumanforesightcan，whatexpeditionsaresafeandwhatdangerous？
Thatmaybeassumed。
Andtheywilltakethemonthesafeexpeditionsandbecautiousaboutthedangerousones？
True。
Andtheywillplacethemunderthecommandofexperiencedveteranswhowillbetheirleadersandteachers？
Veryproperly。
Still，thedangersofwarcannotbealwaysforeseen；thereisagooddealofchanceaboutthem？
True。
Thenagainstsuchchancesthechildrenmustbeatoncefurnishedwithwings，inorderthatinthehourofneedtheymayflyawayandescape。
Whatdoyoumean？hesaid。
Imeanthatwemustmountthemonhorsesintheirearliestyouth，andwhentheyhavelearnttoride，takethemonhorsebacktoseewar：thehorsesmustbespiritedandwarlike，butthemosttractableandyettheswiftestthatcanbehad。Inthiswaytheywillgetanexcellentviewofwhatishereaftertobetheirownbusiness；andifthereisdangertheyhaveonlytofollowtheirelderleadersandescape。
Ibelievethatyouareright，hesaid。
Next，astowar；whataretobetherelationsofyoursoldierstooneanotherandtotheirenemies？Ishouldbeinclinedtoproposethatthesoldierwholeaveshisrankorthrowsawayhisarms，orisguiltyofanyotheractofcowardice，shouldbedegradedintotherankofahusbandmanorartisan。Whatdoyouthink？
Byallmeans，Ishouldsay。
Andhewhoallowshimselftobetakenprisonermayaswellbemadeapresentoftohisenemies；heistheirlawfulprey，andletthemdowhattheylikewithhim。
Certainly。
Buttheherowhohasdistinguishedhimself，whatshallbedonetohim？Inthefirstplace，heshallreceivehonourinthearmyfromhisyouthfulcomrades；everyoneoftheminsuccessionshallcrownhim。Whatdoyousay？
Iapprove。
Andwhatdoyousaytohisreceivingtherighthandoffellowship？
Tothattoo，Iagree。
Butyouwillhardlyagreetomynextproposal。
Whatisyourproposal？
Thatheshouldkissandbekissedbythem。
Mostcertainly，andIshouldbedisposedtogofurther，andsay：Letnoonewhomhehasamindtokissrefusetobekissedbyhimwhiletheexpeditionlasts。Sothatiftherebealoverinthearmy，whetherhislovebeyouthormaiden，hemaybemoreeagertowintheprizeofvalour。
Capital，Isaid。Thatthebravemanistohavemorewivesthanothershasbeenalreadydetermined：andheistohavefirstchoicesinsuchmattersmorethanothers，inorderthathemayhaveasmanychildrenaspossible？
Agreed。
Again，thereisanothermannerinwhich，accordingtoHomer，braveyouthsshouldbehonoured；forhetellshowAjax，afterhehaddistinguishedhimselfinbattle，wasrewardedwithlongchines，whichseemstobeacomplimentappropriatetoaherointheflowerofhisage，beingnotonlyatributeofhonourbutalsoaverystrengtheningthing。
Mosttrue，hesaid。
Theninthis，Isaid，Homershallbeourteacher；andwetoo，atsacrificesandonthelikeoccasions，willhonourthebraveaccordingtothemeasureoftheirvalour，whethermenorwomen，withhymnsandthoseotherdistinctionswhichwewerementioning；alsowithseatsofprecedence，andmeatsandfullcups；
andinhonouringthem，weshallbeatthesametimetrainingthem。
That，hereplied，isexcellent。
Yes，Isaid；andwhenamandiesgloriouslyinwarshallwenotsay，inthefirstplace，thatheisofthegoldenrace？
Tobesure。
Nay，havewenottheauthorityofHesiodforaffirmingthatwhentheyaredeadTheyareholyangelsupontheearth，authorsofgood，avertersofevil，theguardiansofspeech—giftedmen？
Yes；andweaccepthisauthority。
Wemustlearnofthegodhowwearetoorderthesepultureofdivineandheroicpersonages，andwhatistobetheirspecialdistinctionandwemustdoashebids？
Byallmeans。
Andinagestocomewewillreverencethemandknee。beforetheirsepulchresasatthegravesofheroes。Andnotonlytheybutanywhoaredeemedpre—eminentlygood，whethertheydiefromage，orinanyotherway，shallbeadmittedtothesamehonours。
Thatisveryright，hesaid。
Next，howshalloursoldierstreattheirenemies？Whataboutthis？
Inwhatrespectdoyoumean？
Firstofall，inregardtoslavery？DoyouthinkitrightthatHellenesshouldenslaveHellenicStates，orallowotherstoenslavethem，iftheycanhelp？Shouldnottheircustombetosparethem，consideringthedangerwhichthereisthatthewholeracemayonedayfallundertheyokeofthebarbarians？
Tosparethemisinfinitelybetter。
ThennoHelleneshouldbeownedbythemasaslave；thatisarulewhichtheywillobserveandadvisetheotherHellenestoobserve。
Certainly，hesaid；theywillinthiswaybeunitedagainstthebarbariansandwillkeeptheirhandsoffoneanother。
Nextastotheslain；oughttheconquerors，Isaid，totakeanythingbuttheirarmour？Doesnotthepracticeofdespoilinganenemyaffordanexcusefornotfacingthebattle？Cowardsskulkaboutthedead，pretendingthattheyarefulfillingaduty，andmanyanarmybeforenowhasbeenlostfromthisloveofplunder。
Verytrue。